Proper Episode Order

[Jaymstr]

Hi, this is my first post, couldn't really find an answer for this after searching, so here it goes.

Okay, I can never get the right answer on this. I want to know what the proper, chronological order fro all of the newer Marvel cartoons is. Could someone point me to a site. (My guess is probably not, and if that is true, let's decide it right here.)

The cartoons I am specifically interested in are Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk, The Avengers, The Fantastic Four, X-Men, X-Men Evolution, The Silver Surfer, and The 90's Spider-Man (the new Spider-Man is already determined by the DVD, and Unlimited was definitely proper).

TV-Tome has some helpful information, so here are the links to each of their respective sites.
http://www.tvtome.com/IronMan/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/IncredibleHulk_1996/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/Avengers_1999/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/FantasticFour/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/XMen/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/XMenEvolution/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/SilverSurfer/eplist.html
http://www.tvtome.com/tvtome/servlet/EpisodeGuideServlet/showid-2439/SpiderMan/

Keep in mind, this is proper, chronogical order. (This does not always correspond with production order.) Well, I hope this turns into a good discussion, and let me start it with my take on Spider-Man.

The only season that is a little vague is season 1 for Spider-Man. The rest of the seasons all have chapter titles. The thing that confuses me about Spider-man is the production numbers of The Alien Costume (a three parter). They are not one right after the other, so obviously, production order is not chronological.

[Jon T]

Well as a general rule, when animated shows such as these turn up in other countries, they are often shown in their intended (chronological) order. This is purely/luckily due to the laziness of the TV companies who'll simply show each episode as it's been presented to them - they have nothing to gain by wasting time watching the eps and re-arranging their order themselves for any reason. Due to the sometimes sporadic nature of US TV (stuff being pre-empted, re-arranged for sweeps), the intended order of eps does come undone, particularly where cartoons are concerned. Living in the UK however, I can at least shed a little light on some of the shows you mentioned.

Common sense would dictate that a proper chronological order would follow the production order, except where this would obviously be wrong (as in the case of multi-part stories with non-consecutive episode nos as you pointed out). However, this is obviously not always the case (just look at MTV Spidey's ep order on DVD and compare to both broadcast & production orders!), so I'll do my best to provide a proper story order for each show.

Spider-Man (1994): as far as this is concerned, the first season episode order on TV Tome is exactly the same as the order they were shown in the UK, so that does indeed seem to be the eps' intended order - which as you can see, does vary wildly from production order.

The Incredible Hulk (1996): We got this one in production order, so "Man To Man, Beast To Beast" is supposed to come before "Innocent Blood".

The Silver Surfer: No problems there, the aired order is the correct one.

The Avengers: The order of eps we got was different from the US aired order and production order, in that "Egg-Streme Vengeance" was shown as episode 4, rather than 10.

X-Men (1992): Ah, I'm saving the most convoluted for last! This show was really messed around by Fox in the US, so I'll try and sort everything out as best I can season by season.

Season 1: No problems here, since the eps all clearly follow on from each other anyway, so the aired order is correct.

Season 2: Again, no problems or inconsistencies with the aired order with regards to the story.

Season 3: This was the first season where Fox really started to interfere with the episode order, and was quite clearly intended to be at least double the length of the previous two seasons (i.e. at least 26 episodes), of which the correct order is:

3-1 Out Of The Past Part 1
3-2 Out Of The Past Part 2
3-3 The Phoenix Saga Part 1
3-4 The Phoenix Saga Part 2
3-5 The Phoenix Saga Part 3
3-6 The Phoenix Saga Part 4
3-7 The Phoenix Saga Part 5
3-8 No Mutant Is An Island
3-9 Obsession
3-10 Cold Comfort
3-11 Savage Land, Strange Heart Part 1
3-12 Savage Land, Strange Heart Part 2
3-13 Dark Phoenix Part 1
3-14 Dark Phoenix Part 2
3-15 Dark Phoenix Part 3
3-16 Dark Phoenix Part 4
3-17 Orphan's End
3-18 The Juggernaut Returns
3-19 Sanctuary Part 1
3-20 Sanctuary Part 2
3-21 Weapon X, Lies, And Videotape
3-22 Secrets, Not Long Buried
3-23 Nightcrawler
3-24 Courage
3-25 Proteus Part 1
3-26 Proteus Part 2

As you can see, this is quite different from how they were shown in the US! But this is the right order, as this is how they were shown by Fox Kids UK (who at the time were quite reliable for showing things in order), and the eps all have the same style of closing credits, which were slightly changed the following season. One more very interesting thing about this season is that there's apparently an episode missing! This is noticeable for this season (and will also become noticeable later), in that after Jean Grey "dies" at the end of the Phoenix Saga it seems that the producers of the show intended for there to be an episode actually showing Jean returning to the Earth. This is actually explicitly stated in Dark Phoenix Part 1. The episode "No Mutant Is An Island" (which was held over until much later in the US) does say that Jean is actually alive, but this is more of an implication than a solid fact, and we don't see her coming back to Earth in a blaze of (Phoenix?) glory. By the time of "Savage Land, Strange Heart Part 1", there is dialogue indicating that Jean is indeed already on Earth, with us viewers just happening to miss the grand reunion. Considering the show's strong attitude to continuity, there had to have been an episode planned to show the Phoenix's return that for some reason got canned.

Season 4: This season was only 12 episodes long instead of 13, again strengthening the implication that there's a missing Phoenix episode, since otherwise, the show would've reached the (old) magical syndication episode count of 65:

4-1 One Man's Worth Part 1
4-2 One Man's Worth Part 2
4-3 Beyond Good & Evil Part 1
4-4 Beyond Good & Evil Part 2
4-5 Beyond Good & Evil Part 3
4-6 Beyond Good & Evil Part 4
4-7 The Lotus & The Steel
4-8 Love In Vain
4-9 Have Yourself A Morlock Little X-Mas
4-10 Xavier Remembers
4-11 Family Ties
4-12 A Deal With The Devil

Season 5: Again, another 12 episode season, with an episode order of:

5-1 The Phalanx Covenant Part 1
5-2 The Phalanx Covenant Part 2
5-3 Storm Front Part 1
5-4 Storm Front Part 2
5-5 Bloodlines
5-6 Longshot
5-7 The Fifth Horseman
5-8 Jubilee's Fairytale Theatre
5-9 Old Soldiers
5-10 Hidden Agenda
5-11 Descent
5-12 Graduation Day

The style of each season's end credits font (and the year in the copyright) confirms that this is indeed how the episodes were meant to be shown. If it ever gets released in DVD box sets, it'll be interesting to see if they stick with this order.

As for the other shows, I haven't seen enough of the later eps of X-Men: Evolution to know what's the right order, and the Marvel Action Hour series was shown in a very strange order over here that wasn't from the US airdate order and clearly wasn't chronological - it may have been solely based on production nos.

Well, I hope all that's a help to someone!

[Sandoz]

As for the other shows, I haven't seen enough of the later eps of X-Men: Evolution to know what's the right order, I think I can clarify X-Men: Evolution's order.

Season 1: 13 episodes, aired in production order.

Season 2: Kids' Wb ordered an additional four episodes, bringing the count to 17. Certain episodes, such as Walk On The Wild Side and Operation: Rebirth, were aired out of order (causing some minor confusion; for example, Duncan Matthews bought tickets for a dance that took place in an episode that aired earlier). On Angel's Wings was held back to air over the holidays.

Here's the correct Season 2 order:
14: Growing Pains
15: Power Surge
16: Bada-Bing Bada-Boom
17: Fun and Games
18: Beast of Bayville
19: Adrift
20: On Angel's Wings
21: African Storm
22: Joyride
23. Walk On The Wild Side
24: Operation: Rebirth
25: Mindbender
26: Shadow Dance
27: Retreat
28: The HeX Factor
29: Day of Reckoning, Pt. 1
30: Day of Reckoning, Pt. 2

Season 3: The final 4 out of the 13 eps were witheld till the following fall. Ep. 40, Cruise Control, was aired after #43, Dark Horizon, Pt. 2.

Season 4: 9 episodes aired in order.

Hope that helps.

[Jaymstr]

Ya guys, this helps a ton. Any other ideas?

By the way I think The Fantastic Four aired in proper order. The stories just seem to flow properly, but that is only from reading short summaries of each episode.

[rikerdonegal]

Well, I hope all that's a help to someone!Thanks a million. I have been looking for a list like this for years. Thanks for doing it up.

rikerdonegal

[STARTOUNZ]

X-Men (1992): Ah, I'm saving the most convoluted for last! This show was really messed around by Fox in the US, so I'll try and sort everything out as best I can season by season.

Season 1: No problems here, since the eps all clearly follow on from each other anyway, so the aired order is correct.


I think the editor for that show went by production order. Season 1 did air out of sequence the first time it was originally broadcast on Fox. "The Cure" aired "Slave Island", followed by "Unstoppable Juggernaut", then "Come the Apocalypse". Recall that the Xavier Institute was found demolished at the end of "Slave Island". The X-Men later learned Juggernaut was responsible, so "Unstoppable Juggernaut" should have aired after that. "The Cure" and "Come the Apocalypse" was the 2-parter that introduced Angel, who thanks to Mystique, became Archangel.

[Monarch]

the Marvel Action Hour series was shown in a very strange order over here that wasn't from the US airdate order and clearly wasn't chronological - it may have been solely based on production nos.

What order would that be, then? Anyone know?

[Jeffrey Logan]

What order would that be, then? Anyone know?
2nd seasons were played in right order, but 1st seasons weren't. In my country Fantastic Four started a week earlier than Iron Man. I'm 90% sure this was the order of the episodes of Fantastic Four in my country:

1. The Origin Of The Fantastic Four, Part 1
2. The Origin Of The Fantastic Four, Part 2
3. The Silver Surfer & The Coming Of Galactus, Part 1
4. The Silver Surfer & The Coming Of Galactus, Part 2
5. Mole Man
6. Behold The Negative Zone
7. Superskrull
8. The Silver Surfer & The Return Of Galactus
9. The Mask Of Doom, Part 1
10. The Mask Of Doom, Part 2
11. The Mask Of Doom, Part 3
12. Now Comes The Sub-Mariner
13. Incursion Of The Skrulls

I'm 100% sure about the order of the episodes of Iron Man:

1. And The Sea Shall Give Up Its Dead
2. Data In, Chaos Out
3. Silence My Companion, Death My Destination
4. The Grim Reaper Wears A Teflon Coat
5. Rejoice! I Am Ultimo. Thy Deliverer
6. Enemy Without, Enemy Within
7. The Defection Of Hawkeye
8. The Origin Of The Mandarin
9. Iron Man To The Second Power, Part 1
10. Iron Man To The Second Power, Part 2
11. The Origin Of Iron Man, Part 1
12. The Origin Of Iron Man, Part 2
13. The Wedding Of Iron Man

Nothing really went wrong with Iron Man, when some episodes were played out of order, but it did turn Fantastic Four into "mystery". The Mask Of Doom trilogy was meant as the introduction of Dr.Doom. Instead it was the return of Dr.Doom. Skrulls invented SuperSkrull after Reed laughed at them. Instead after the defeat, they came back to earth without remembering Fantastic 4.

[dmxx116]

2nd seasons were played in right order, but 1st seasons weren't. In my country Fantastic Four started a week earlier than Iron Man. I'm 90% sure this was the order of the episodes of Fantastic Four in my country:

1. The Origin Of The Fantastic Four, Part 1
2. The Origin Of The Fantastic Four, Part 2
5. The Silver Surfer & The Coming Of Galactus, Part 1
6. The Silver Surfer & The Coming Of Galactus, Part 2
11. Mole Man
12. Behold The Negative Zone
7. Superskrull
13. The Silver Surfer & The Return Of Galactus
8. The Mask Of Doom, Part 1
9. The Mask Of Doom, Part 2
10. The Mask Of Doom, Part 3
3. Now Comes The Sub-Mariner
4. Incursion Of The Skrulls

I'm 100% sure about the order of the episodes of Iron Man:

1. And The Sea Shall Give Up Its Dead
2. Data In, Chaos Out
5. Silence My Companion, Death My Destination
4. The Grim Reaper Wears A Teflon Coat
3. Rejoice! I Am Ultimo. Thy Deliverer
12. Enemy Without, Enemy Within
8. The Defection Of Hawkeye
9. The Origin Of The Mandarin
6. Iron Man To The Second Power, Part 1
7. Iron Man To The Second Power, Part 2
10. The Origin Of Iron Man, Part 1
11. The Origin Of Iron Man, Part 2
13. The Wedding Of Iron Man

Nothing really went wrong with Iron Man, when some episodes were played out of order, but it did turn Fantastic Four into "mystery". The Mask Of Doom trilogy was meant as the introduction of Dr.doom. Instead it was the return of Dr.Doom. Skrulls invented SuperSkrull after Reed laughed at them. Instead after the defeat, they came back to earth without remembering Fantastic 4.That not the real proper Iron Man and Fantastic Four episode order.

[Jon T]

2nd seasons were played in right order, but 1st seasons weren't. In my country Fantastic Four started a week earlier than Iron Man. I'm 90% sure this was the order of the episodes of Fantastic Four in my country:

That's the same order the episodes were shown in the UK, and the same order Iron Man was in on DVD. The forthcoming Fantastic Four DVD from Liberation has the episodes in that order as well.

[Monarch]

Aside from "Super Skrull" and "Mole Man" being flipped, that order matches that of the numbers from the US Saban Syndication run in 97-98. Same for Iron Man. UPN Kids had yet another set of numbers and order for FF (while Iron Man remained exactly the same):

UPN KIDS FF numbers
01:-"The Origin Of The Fantastic Four" (part 1)
02:-"The Origin Of The Fantastic Four" (part 2)
03:-"Incursion Of The Skrull"
04:-"Now Comes The Sub-Mariner"
05:-"The Silver Surfer And The Coming Of Galactus, Part I"
06:-"The Silver Surfer And The Coming Of Galactus" (part 2)
07:-"Super Skrull"
08:-"The Mask Of Doom" (part 1)
09:-"The Mask Of Doom" (part 2)
10:-"The Mask Of Doom" (part 3)
11:-"The Silver Surfer And The Return Of Galactus"
12:-"Mole Man"
13:-"Behold The Negative Zone"

For actual the "Marvel Action Hour" blocks, I only have a few of the original affiliate feeds taped from the old C-Band days. I unfortunately didn't keep records of all of the production numbers (I do recall that "Mask of Doom" lacked sequential production numbering). But this does at least give you an idea of how they first aired together. Notice, MAH 5 and 6 had their episodes re-associated with other shows later on, meaning they only aired together once or twice. Despite common belief that every episode was finished by December, the finalization dates (included on three of them below) prove otherwise, that the final few episodes premiered in January and February 95. Another fun fact often lost to the ages: "Origin of the Fantastic Four Part 2" did NOT air as the second episode of FF. It wasn't finished in time, forcing them to run the Sub-Mariner episode instead.

MAH #01 = IM 59499-01 "And the Sea.." & FF 49499-01 "Origin of the FF 1"
MAH #02 = IM 59499-03 "Data In Chaos Out" & "Now Comes the Sub-Mariner"
MAH #03 = IM "Silence my Companion" & FF 49499-11 "Origin of the FF 2"
MAH #04 = IM "Grim Reaper wears Teflon" & FF "Incursion of the Skrull"
MAH #05 = IM "Ultimo" & FF "Silver Surfer & the Coming of Galactus 1"
MAH #06 = IM "Enemy Without, Enemy Within" & FF "Silver Surfer & the Coming of Galactus 2"
Marvel Action Hour #07 (11/4/94)= IM 59499-13 "Origin of the Mandarin" & FF 49499-08 "Super Skrull"
MAH #08 = IM "Defection of Hawkeye" & FF "Mask of Doom 1"
MAH #09 = IM R "Rejoice! I am Ultimo" & FF "Mask of Doom 2"
MAH #10 = IM R "Enemy Within, Enemy Without" & FF "Mask of Doom 3"
Marvel Action Hour #11 (1/13/95)= IM 59499-08 "Iron Man to the 2nd Power, part 1" & FF 49499-13 "Behold the Negative Zone"
Marvel Action Hour #12 (1/20/95)= IM 59499-06 "Iron Man to the 2nd Power, part 2" & FF 49499-09 "Mole Man"
MAH #13 = IM "Origin of Iron Man 1" & FF R "Silver Surfer & the Coming of Galactus 1"
MAH #14 = IM "Origin of Iron Man 2" & FF R "Silver Surfer & the Coming of Galactus 2"
MAH #15 = IM "The Wedding of Iron Man" & FF 49499-10 "Silver Surfer & the Return of Galactus"