CBC's Fresh Question #17. I've got a Secret, Identity that is?!?!? With a Poll too!!

[Emerald Archer]

Hello everyone.

Our last question seemed to get a lot of people thinking about how minorities are treated in comics. I got a great email form a rather famous member of the comic industry who pointed out to me, after reading the question, that while Black American's are poorly represented in comics, so are every other minority. Makes you wonder.

A great big thank you to Ace the Bathound for suggesting this weeks question. It's interesting to note that what I'm about to shout out to you has been a pretty strong point of debate among my friends here in the local comic community, so let's see if it sparks as much controversy on a much larger scale.

And as always out previous missions to galaxies far far away are available right through this door. (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=101998)
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CBC's Fresh Question #17. I've got a Secret, Identity that is?!?!?

"Well we all have a face
That we hide away forever
And we take them out and show ourselves
When everyone has gone
Some are satin some are steel
Some are silk and some are leather
They're the faces of the stranger
But we love to try them on"
Billy Joel "The Stranger" 1972

It's like Mom, and Apple Pie, Hot dogs and Mustard, Abbot and Costello. Heroes and Secret Identities go hand in hand. Or at least they use to. But something has happened lately. All of a sudden heroes are shedding their secrets and standing out in the light as their own person.

The first that I can recall was Wally West revealing to the world that he was The Flash. Since then, we've seen a lot of heroes shed their secrets. Captain America, Iron man, Daredevil to name just a few. Even in the Batman universe, Riddler knows that Bruce Wayne is Batman. Diana has given up her secret and is now just Wonder Woman. And Tim Drake is stepping downs as Robin because he is "outed".

Indeed, this summer DC is launching a reboot of it's universe called "Identity Crisis." Early buzz is that the threat to the heroes comes when someone discovers who they are behind the capes and masks.

Now, I usually refrain from going off the editorial deep end when I post these questions, but I just have to this time.

Heroes NEED secret identities. Remember, during the golden age, superheroes were known as Mystery Men. And they should remain that way. What happens to Bruce Wayne when The Joker discovers who he is. The secret of the identity is to protect the people around the hero, and not the hero them self. Bruce can take care of himself. Can Alfred? If a one on one between Alfred and Joker, heck between Alfred and Catman, the villain wins.

From a literary point, the secret identity allows all of us to imagine that it is us behind the mask or cowl. We could be Batman, Green Lantern, Iron Man, or Daredevil. We can't be them if everyone KNOWS that Tony Stark is Iron man and Not John Smith of Anywheres-ville USA. The lost of the secret identity, at least to me, makes the hero less interesting. How does a person balance the public from the private persona? Once that private side is lost, does not the hero have less in common with the people he or she is trying to protect? Would we not have more to fear from a Superman if he didn't have to mingle with the masses on a daily basis. Would he not lose touch with who he is protecting and beginning to assume the position of almost a God Head?

The Mighty Thor for the last year has been attempting, in a way, to deal with this topic. What happens when Thor no longer connects with us mear mortals. The son of Odin, no longer protects us, he takes care of us. He becomes a religious figure to some, and a benign, or not so benign (depending on your viewpoint) caretaker to all of humanity. Unfortunately, at least to me, the story that is being told isn't very compelling.

Just as a final note, Wally West recently managed to regain his secret identity thanks to The Spectre. Wally discovered that when everyone knows who you are, your family and friends become targets for every lunatic out there. Wally and his wife paid a high price for that realization.

Heroes need Secret Identities. Now I want to hear from you!

[Jor-El]

In my experience as a comic reader, I am always most interested in a character and in their stories when the story focuses on the secret identity in some manner. This is not to say that I have liked the issues of Green Lantern when Kyle Rayner went around dealing with Terry Berg and gay issues and never really turned into Green Lantern and did something. But the really good stories are the ones where secret ID's are a factor. I'm thinking here of "The Late Mr. Kent" episode of Superman: The Animated Series and even the comic arc that it may have been loosely based upon, "The Death of Clark Kent." The secret ID arc in Waid's JLA was another great example of this.

Other than that, you said everything on the matter perfectly yourself, Archer. It was a great post.

[Stu]

I like it when they interact. Like, where was Wally when The Flash was about and such. It borders on ridicolous sometimes, like how Lois managed to speak to Clark and Superman like, everyday, but never managed to see them at the same time.

I like the Peter Parker/Spider-Man best, naturally. The best incidents are when someone comes close to figureing it all out. An example of this would be when the world discoverd that Superman is married when he was pictured with a ring on his hand. The ending wasn't a huge cop out either, despite how rushed it all felt. And of course, the best example, is Matt Murdock really Daredevil, or is it just a tabloid story?

Bruce Wayne/Batman is a little too underplayed, like the '89 film, Bruce really is just there while your waiting for Batman to show up. I like the charm the character has in the cartoon, its wonderfully portrayed, no one would think Bruce is Batman, but he wasn't a jerk either.

[randomguy]

I've been thinking a lot about this lately, and even went so far as to post a thread about it, in Daredevil's case. In the end, my feelings vary depending on what hero we're dealing with. It really comes down to two very simple questions: is the secret identity plausible, and does it add anything to the hero's character? If the answer to both is no, than I'd prefer not to see the identity. Indeed, in many cases, I felt that for a good chunk of time (pretty much the entire Silver Age) most identities were there simply because everybody felt like they had to be there. Don't get me wrong: identities are core features of many heroes, and shouldn't be readily disposed. However, there's no sense in keeping them simply for the sake of having them there.

So this is one of those trends that you can't really give a universal answer to. For Captain America, I really like the loss of the secret identity, because Steve Rogers never really added much to Cap's character, if anything. For the X-Men, the loss of secret identities is the way it should have been from the very beginning, because it increases the power of their message. I often wish that no Green Lantern (outside of Alan Scott) had ever had a secret identity; accepting the Green Lantern ring is accepting a job, so I always found it implausible that anybody would hide that. Besides, it's full-time work policing a whole section of the universe, so I could never buy that Hal Jordan or Kyle Rayner could find time to be a mechanic or artist in addition to that. Similiarly, Wonder Woman is a job for Diana, because of her ambassador role, so I'm glad that she's lost her secret identity. I found it hopelessly boring anyway.

There's some of them I'm not really sure about. I've yet to come to a conclusion about Tony Stark, whose identity provided the basis for some very interesting stories throughout his career, as well as adding a nice dimension to Iron Man himself. Then again, the book's current direction is dealing with the chracter's recently exposed status in a brilliant way. We shall see.

For Wally West, I was kinda frustrated. I'd always liked the secret identity of the Flash, and part of the character's appeal has always been his everyman status. I'm glad his identity is back. Although I like what Bendis is doing with Daredevil, I'm pretty convinced that in the long term, it was a bad choice. If Peter Parker, Clark Kent, or Bruce Wayne were ever to lose their identities, I'd be royally pissed. So it really all depends on what character we're dealing with.

[Bubblegum Girl]

Having a secret indentity may be good for the story but wouldn't it be more interesting if all of the bad guys knew who the hero was?

[Emerald Archer]

Perhaps it would be interesting, but I would think that about 50% of the heroes in the world would pack it in and call it a career. Wally West is a prime example:


SPOILER Warning:































The death of his two unborn twins was a direct result of Professor Zoom knowing that Wally was the Flash. And his wife leaving him is a result of her now knowing that Wally is the Flash. Every hero would lose somebody they love, and would they want to continue playing the game if they kept losing their loved ones?

EA

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,

As the guy who proposed the question, it's odd that I'm kind of scattered about the response :). After thinking about it some more, I have three real talking points about it: secret identity as a tool in a writer's toolchest, characters where the secret identity is truly integral to the character, and the weird bit where I get all meta and talk about deeper meanings and people's eyes glaze over and they go "OooooOOkay." I'll try to get to all three during the week, but you get part 1 tonight.

I generally agree with randomguy that keeping or losing a secret identity needs to hinge on the identity being plausible and truly integral to the character. While plausibility isn't usually much of an issue, I think there are very, very few characters where the secret identity is truly core to the character. More on who and why later.

In almost every other case, the secret identity serves primarily as a plot device in one of three ways: 1) the hero can't become the hero because doing so will reveal the secret, 2) someone finds out the hero's secret, and dire consequences follow, and 3) the hero has to go to some great length to keep his or her identity a secret. I'm sure there are others, but think back in your favorite comics stories and see how often those plot elements crop up. I think half or more of the comics in the Golden and Silver Ages relied on those three plot devices.

I'm not saying you can't do good stories from those plot devices. The climax of Spider-Man's Gwen Stacy story arc (and the climax of the Spider-Man movie inspired by it), the Hugo Strange stories in Batman comics and BTAS, a recent issue of Batman Adventures where Bruce was undercover as Matches Malone, the issue of Astro City where a small time hood discovers Jack-in-the-Box's identity -- all of these terrific stories hinge on secret identities. There's nothing inherently wrong with using the secret identity as a way to drive the plot.

The only problem is that the tool of the secret identity can get really old while the characters can't. In some sense, I think the rash of secret identities becoming public is just the culmination of 30+ years of comic history coming to bear on plot device #2 above -- the "someone" becomes the general public instead of just a villain who opts to use the identity for revenge. How many times can you tell the same story without it getting tiresome? How long can you really respect Lois Lane, an investigative journalist no less, when she can't see what's right in front of her eyes?

Next up: who really needs these things and why.

-- Ed/Ace

[Sharklady]

> It really comes down to two very simple questions: is the secret identity plausible, and does it add anything to the hero's character? <

I defy anybody to put it better.

Certainly a secret identity is not *per say* essencial to make a superhero interesting- Wonder Woman and Thor are good examples of characters who just didn't gain much from it.

I imagine the convention caught on so generally, because two of comicdom's greatest success stories, Superman and Batman, are characters whose secret identities *do* lend them extra depth. Superman has stated outright, that he derives an essential psychological benefit from being able to periodically slip into a Common Man persona. It's also useful from a script-writer's prospective; the contrast between the Man Of Steel and the mild-mannered reporter (and that outrageously inadequate disguise) is an endless source of humor.

With Batman the schism is even deeper; he has an actual duel nature, personified by the millionaire playboy and the tormented vigilante. I've no doubt, that disturbing circumstance is exactly why the Dark Knight has stood the test of time so well.

[Anthonynotes]

I'm for secret identities as well---even if there were times in comics' history (such as the 50's/60's) where Lois seemed to not have a life beyond trying to prove Clark Kent was really Superman... :-)

-B.

[theodoreLogan]

I agree with randomguy and sharklady...it depends on the hero. Do the X-Men really NEED secret identities? More than half of them walk around without masks anyway...and remember when Jean Grey's codename was: Jean Grey?

Leave the secret identities to those characters who have made it a point to try and keep their identities a secret since their inception into the comic world.

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,

This started as just a list on who I thought really needed a secret identity. However, instead of just making a laundry list, I decided to focus on four distinct comic book characters who use the secret identity story device in interesting ways, and where losing the secret identity will truly damage the character. Leaving someone off this list doesn't necessarily mean the secret identity is unnecessary, but probably that it's a lot less critical than you'd think. The fact that they're all from DC is coincidental, I think.

1. ROSE AND THORN: Recently revived in Gail Simone's 5-issue limited series, Rose/Thorn is interesting because the character's multiple personality disorder means that the crime-fighting Thorn identity is a secret from the timid Rose personality and (I believe) vice versa. This makes her possibly the only hero who is keeping the secret identity from herself. Rose and Thorn have had a persistent but low-profile role in the DC Universe. I suspect that the issues raised by her identity are what make her interesting to writers.

2. THE PHANTOM STRANGER: This classic mystic of the DC Universe takes the Rose and Thorn concept even further by keeping his true identity secret not only from the character, but from the reader as well. A secret origins issue dedicated to him in the 80's had several entirely separate, unrelated origin stories, none of which were ever blessed as "official." The Stranger is a complete blank, where his Secret Identity IS his identity. Giving him a definitive origin story would rob him of everything that makes him interesting as a character.

3. CHRIS CHANCE, THE HUMAN TARGET: Where the Phantom Stranger suffers from a complete lack of identity, Chris Chance has the exact opposite problem. Oddly enough, the net result is almost the same. A master of disguise, Chance deliberately places himself in harm's way to impersonate people in immediate peril, while trying to unravel the plots against his clients. From what I understand, the recent graphic novels and monthly comic written by Peter Milligan is the first Human Target series that works with an explicit subtext involving questions of identity. If Chris Chance spends all his time pretending to be other people, then who exactly is Chris Chance? In adopting too many secret identities, Chance has perhaps lost his own. At the same time, the ability to fully become another person is the only thing that defines Chance as a character -- without it, he's nothing.

4. HOLDEN CARVER: The central character of Ed Brubaker's Sleeper, Carver is a secret agent working undercover in a massive criminal organization. Unfortunately, the only person who knows that Carver is truly on the side of the angels is in a coma, leaving Carver out in the cold with nobody else knowing who he truly is. Brubaker deftly combines the classic superhero secret identity with the spy thriller, creating a character with deeply compelling reasons to both maintain and reveal his disguise. He must maintain his secret identity both to stay alive and to infiltrate deeper into the syndicate, but the actions necessary to maintain his cover become ever more corrosive to his sanity and make it increasingly harder for him to be believed if he does come out of the cold. There are no other comic book heroes I can think of offhand with such a compelling need to both reveal and obscure their true identity.

Other posters have already talked about Superman. My only addition to their comments is that every Superman story that ends up with him as a super-powered totalitarian bully begins with him abandoning his identity as Clark Kent. I don't think this is an accident.

Next up: OooooOOkay.

-- Ed/Ace

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,

Science fiction and fantasy have a way of expressing people's fears, anxieties, and concerns through parable and metaphor. Sometimes, the parable is explicit and intentional; Godzilla is a stand-in for spectre of atomic weapons and the Pod People in Invasion of the Body Snatchers express fears over totalitarian thought control. Sometimes, the metaphor is implicit or subconscious; among other things, RoboCop and The Terminator have deeply ambivalent attitudes over the Faustian bargain technology imposes on us, and the horrific side-effects that result when the machine is made more important than the human.

Privacy and the loss of it in the electronic age is a topic that's been in the news a lot of late. Identity theft is one of the fastest growing crimes today. It's getting harder and harder to keep something secret or private, and I have to wonder if the losing of secret identities is just a manifestation of this modern anxiety projected into comics panels.

In some way, this trend is just reflecting modern sensibilities. Count up how many cameras took your picture today -- if you live in a major metropolitan area, I'd bet it was at least a half-dozen. Political parties and marketing companies expend considerable effort creating a profile of you around all the information they can get their hands on. The government has stated explicitly that it wants to create gigantic databases of information from all sources to try and catch criminals and terrorists. How many people do you know who were victims of identity theft? (The answer to that last question is at least 1, because you "know" me, BTW.) Given the incredible amount of surveillance we are under in the modern world, from quarters with the best and the basest interests at heart, how could anybody realistically maintain a secret identity as a superhero?

In other ways, this trend is an implicit parable. In having their deepest secrets exposed to the harsh light of public scrutiny, the superheroes become our stand-ins, and their fears of exposure become our fears for exposure. When many newer heroes debut without any secret identity at all, perhaps the undertone is that we are living in an era of no privacy, so attempting to maintain it is both unnecessary and futile.

Sometimes, the fears that pop fiction addresses turn out to be overblown. Them! replaced Communist hordes with ravenous giant ants, but the threat from that quarter turned out to have been more in our heads than in reality. Sometimes, they're exactly on the mark -- the original Godzilla has probably become more relevant (and more ignored) over the years as nuclear weapons proliferate, threatening to turn small-scale conflicts into small-scale holocausts. I have no idea if my speculation on secret identities is true, but if it is, only time will tell if it turned out to be excessively paranoid or not paranoid enough.

-- Ed/Ace