Dragon Ball? Or Dragon Ball Z?

[cognitofalcon]

Which do you prefer? I prefer DBZ because it goes more into character development. Not to mention, It has some of the best Action sequences imagineable. But, DBZ got better as it went on. My favorite part was the Majun Boo saga, the later

[Justy]

Dragonball for me. There's just too much drawn-out fighting for me, even if there's more character development. If I want to see a lot of fights, I'll watch Yu Yu Hakusho. I also like humor a bit more. I do like Dragonball Z Kai, though.

[Mister Intensity]

Actually I felt that Dragon Ball had more character development than Dragon Ball Z. In Dragon Ball we watched the characters grow up right in front of our eyes. The characters in Dragon Ball Z, with the exception of Gohan, really don't change much except for their power levels.

[RonDrakenfan17]

I liked Dragon Ball more towards the end when things started getting picked up. I do think I liked Dragon Ball Z more too, it had way more action and a bit of comedy still. Heck my favorite characters in that series, Gohan.

[Monte]

DragonBall...
Really DBZ was a complete and utter mess when it came to writing
I mean, atleast the writing bits of dragonball that i didn't like i was able to excuse under "it's supposed to just be a zany fun, don't think that hard"... DBZ however takes its self too seriously for that...

Plus i liked how in dragonball there seemed to be some sense of technique involved in the fighting... by the time they got to DBZ it just came down to who could hit who the hardest...

And one thing i really hated about DBZ was how EVERY character introduced in dragonball eventually fell so far behind Goku that they could barely effect the plot because they were so gosh damn weak... no matter how much they trained, they were just doomed to always suck and never even be worth standing in Goku's shadow...

[Takao]

DragonBall.

With the manga and Kai, I'm trying to forget that "Z" exists.

[cuzin34]

dbz

[Jacob T. Paschal]

The forty-two volumes of Dragon Ball.

Even the Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z anime are so similar you could consider them the same show (barring the fact that they aren't).

[ensatsu-ken]

The forty-two volumes of Dragon Ball.

I agree with this. To me, Toriyama's manga for Dragon Ball prevails over any of its anime itterations by miles.

Even the Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z anime are so similar you could consider them the same show (barring the fact that they aren't).

I don't really agree with this sentiment, unless we're considering the much later parts of DB with Piccolo, which were admittedly more serious. Other than that, though, they are almost as different to me as night and day when it comes to the anime adaptations of the manga (though, in the manga, the eary parts of DB still feel very distinct from the latter parts, except for maybe the Majin Buu saga). Around the beginning, Dragon Ball was more like a parody of the tale Journey to the West, with lots of gags thrown in, and with more of a fairy-tale vibe to it, which DBZ constrasted with a more Sci-Fi type of vibe what with all of the outer-space travel, though it did still retain the key parts of the fairy-tale elements, especially with the Buu saga.

The key difference for me, though, was that DBZ seemed to be a bit darker in tone than DB was (and no, I'm not saying that I consider DBZ to be a "dark" anime at all, but just that it had a more serious vibe to it in comparison to DB, IMO). The villains felt like much more of a thread to the heroes, which also gave DBZ a distinct vibe from DB.

But, probably the biggest difference to me was how DB to me felt like an action AND adventure series with lots of good humor thrown in, whereas DBZ felt like an action series combined with lots of good humor (though less of it than DB).

Anyways, that's just how I interpret the differences between the 2 shows, it would have to be DB. Yes, it had many parts that dragged out, but they were all still fun to watch all of the way through, whereas I felt that DBZ could just get way too tiring to watch at times (and I'm usually a pretty patient person when it comes to long-running series like this). I do give credit to DBZ for creating some truly brilliant moments that are still to this day some of the most iconic scenes (especially to me) in anime, as well as having tons of entertainment value to it, but overall I felt that DB was the more entertaining package for me, especially because (and I know that I'm probably the only person out there who feels this way) it had a better use of filler than DBZ did for the most part, IMO. Yeah, I love DBZ's driving episode, and some others, but I'm not a fan of stuff like the Garlic Jr. arc, and I hated the Fake Namek arc. The extended bits showing Gohan's survival training in the Saiyan arc, as well as the Saiyaman filler episodes, were pretty good, though (with the latter just being plain fun to watch since its interesting to see Gohan have to interact with people in a normal environment which he wasn't used to, what with being raised in such an isolated area).

[Jacob T. Paschal]

I say Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z are practically the same show because had there been no change in the logo any casual viewer (or one who had just finished watching Dragon Ball episode #153) could roll over into Dragon Ball Z #1 and visually and audibly see no real difference (new pieces of music were introduced in Dragon Ball Z, but that is no different from what would happen with Dragon Ball). Dragon Ball the anime and Dragon Ball Z were produced with much the same crew. The very week after Dragon Ball #153 aired (4/7/1989), Dragon Ball Z #1 premiered (4/26/1989).


Now, personally...I see little reason to consider the arrival of Raditz as the true 'dark turn' of Dragon Ball. The 22nd Tenka'ichi Budôkai had a credible threatening force in Tenshinhan and the Crane Hermit school. Tao Pai Pai in the Red Ribbon Army arc before was just a taste of Dragon Ball's 'darker' turn, and Tenshinhan without doubt cemented that. Then there's the Piccolo Daimaô arc and 23rd Tenka'ichi which were hardly the cute and harmless gags of Dragon Ball in its first three arcs. Daimaô caused as much carnage as Nappa and Vegeta did, if not more. For these reasons I consider the entire series 'Dragon Ball', seeing no reason to consider one section different from the other when it has always exists as one story with consistent devices.

[ensatsu-ken]

I say Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z are practically the same show because had there been no change in the logo any casual viewer (or one who had just finished watching Dragon Ball episode #153) could roll over into Dragon Ball Z #1 and visually and audibly see no real difference (new pieces of music were introduced in Dragon Ball Z, but that is no different from what would happen with Dragon Ball). Dragon Ball the anime and Dragon Ball Z were produced with much the same crew. The very week after Dragon Ball #153 aired (4/7/1989), Dragon Ball Z #1 premiered (4/26/1989).

You're talking about the series from the perspective of those watching it weekly in Japan, and not really taking into account that most people hear probably watched DBZ first, or at least were introduced to DBZ first (myself included). Now, of course, that might not be much of an argument since I'm sure that you could at least agree that FUNimation's dub of DBZ is clearly distinguishable from either their interpretation of DB or the original Japanese version of DB, but the thing is, I have watched quite a lot of the original DB and DBZ (though, with subtitles, of course), and I still feel that there are many differences between the 2 series. I even felt that way when reading the manga, in how different the beginning was from the later parts of the story.

Now, personally...I see little reason to consider the arrival of Raditz as the true 'dark turn' of Dragon Ball.

I never said that Raditz's arrival was the more "serious" turning point of DB, myself. But I also wouldn't say that it was the 22nd Budokai was, either. It was when Piccolo stepped into the story that things took a more serious turn, but evne then there were still plenty of parts that had that classic DB sense of humor, such as Pilaf serving under Piccolo and serving as a minor comic relief of sorts for a brief time, and there was also Yajirobe, who was also another clear comic relief character that you would expect to come out of early DB.

In terms of Tenshinhan being threatening, I don't see it the same way as you do, since he was on the same general level of skill and power as Goku was. When I said serious threat, I meant enemies who far outpowered Goku, to the point in which even after becoming stronger, he still needed help from others to defeat the opponent. At the beginning of DBZ, Master Roshi implies that Goku has gotten stronger over the past 5 years, and how it surprised hime because he expected him to be much weaker, if anything, being that he probably didn't expect Goku to really keep up with his training. Yet, even then he needed the help of Piccolo to defeat Raditz, and even then they just barely managed to do it by sacrificing Goku's own life (the 1st time that Goku actually died at all, which made Raditz more than even a thread, if anything). And of course, as far as Vegeta goes, he was far stronger than Goku was, to the point that Goku even admitted that he was outclassed by him, even after all of Kaio's training (wecept for when he used Kaio-Ken x3 or higher, which gave him an edge, but he couldn't even keep it up for nearly long enough). In theend it took the combined efforts of him, Gohan, Krillin, and even Yajirobe to defeat Vegeta, and even then they got really lucky with Gohan's involunatry transformation catching Vegeta off-guard at the last second.

Daimaô caused as much carnage as Nappa and Vegeta did, if not more.

Of course, when you think about it, didn't Vegeta purposely instruct Nappa to be careful with the amount of destruction that he caused, so that they wouldn't accidentally destory any dragon balls, and also so that they wouldn't hurt the price they could geto n the planet by damaging it too much? In fact, Nappa was holding back most of the time until Goku arrived (in which case he didn't even have a chance to create any carnage, after being completely dominated in battle). And as for Vegeta, Goku and company were all there to keep his focus on trying to kill them (and when he did actually try to destory the Earth, Goku was just barely able to stop him by going Kaio-Ken x4). In contrast, Piccolo didn't have any real strong opposition to stop him until Goku showed up for a re-match with him, after having had a huge power-up.

For these reasons I consider the entire series 'Dragon Ball', seeing no reason to consider one section different from the other when it has always exists as one story with consistent devices.

That still doesn't explain how those "first 3 arcs" are so drastically different from later arcs. And even the later arcs of DB (referring to the anime, here, for obvious reasons) have significant differences from DBZ arcs, as I've pointed out before.

Also, in early DB (at least from what I read in the manga), Goku sends that whole Rabbit team to the moon on his power-pole. Is there even a gag in DBZ that is even close to as ridiculously over-the-top as that? I mean, I know its just one minor thing scene on a single page, but seriously, small moments like that definte huge differences to me.

Anyways, I'll just leave it off in that I think whether DB and DBZ (or as far as the manga goes, the first 16 volumes of DB compared to the rest) are very different or not is something that's purely up to how one interprets both series. I personally interpretted each very differently, and I always will see them as being very different, though they will always have that 1 core element that makes them both DB, in the end. I'd go into other details, like how I feel that Goku is more naive up until his teenage years, as opposed to his adult version, which is still child-like but also noteably more mature in certain ways, but I'm way too tired of typing now, so perhaps I'll save that for another day.

[rattis1]

DBZ. It's the epic, suspensefull fights that makes me love the show, and since the original DB didn't have nearly as many of them, well...

[Savoury Sauce]

I think the Dragonball series tends to more entertaining when it's more lighthearted in nature, so I'm much more inclinded to second veiwings of most of the events prior to the arrival of Raditz. I also enjoyed the more whimsical settings and characters from earlier in the series, as opposed to the 'sci-fi' route it began to head down once it was revealed Goku is in fact an alien.

That said, I know the saga is generally frowned upon, at least from my experience, but I really enjoyed how completely riduculous a lot of the goings on during the Buu saga were.

[bleachj0j]

I say Dragonball Z because I haven't seen much dragonball. But DBZ became to reliant on Goku. Also the fights weren't suspenseful because they could also be wished back by the dragonballs.

[GWOtaku]

Now, personally...I see little reason to consider the arrival of Raditz as the true 'dark turn' of Dragon Ball. The 22nd Tenka'ichi Budôkai had a credible threatening force in Tenshinhan and the Crane Hermit school. Tao Pai Pai in the Red Ribbon Army arc before was just a taste of Dragon Ball's 'darker' turn, and Tenshinhan without doubt cemented that. Then there's the Piccolo Daimaô arc and 23rd Tenka'ichi which were hardly the cute and harmless gags of Dragon Ball in its first three arcs. Daimaô caused as much carnage as Nappa and Vegeta did, if not more. For these reasons I consider the entire series 'Dragon Ball', seeing no reason to consider one section different from the other when it has always exists as one story with consistent devices.

Eeeeeh, I guess, but the Saiyans come off as more brutal anyhow since they were nigh-unstoppable and nearly killed all of the heroes. It wasn't as hopeless against Piccolo, who narrowly avoided defeat via containment before getting taken down by Goku later.

The Dragon Ball anime did get more serious later on, but there was some levity mixed in too. In the Tournament arc you had the banter in the peanut gallery, and during the Piccolo saga we had that sideplot of Goku meeting Yajirobe and chasing him everywhere, which I thought had a sort of whimsical charm to it. I never quite felt like Dragon Ball Z/the later Dragon Ball manga ever quite caught that consistently. Great Saiyaman successfully did. I don't think Namek really did since so much of it was fighting and frankly, the time outs it took were more tedious than fun--does anyone really fondly remember that time where Bulma had to delve underwater to get the Dragon Balls back?

[Monte]

Ya, i'd say there is a very clear tone difference between Dragonball and DBZ... Even when the series got more serious, Dragonball still had some much more lighthearted moments. I mean even When king piccolo was showing himself as a serious threat to the rest of the world, we still had pilaf's comic relief trio, and we had yajarobi running around and EATING piccolo's minions.

DBZ however... you get next to nothing on a more comic relief side... it was always just drop dead serious about everything... never really taking a time out to do something funny... the only time it actually returned to how it was back in dragonball is in the majin buu saga

[Jacob T. Paschal]

You're talking about the series from the perspective of those watching it weekly in Japan, and not really taking into account that most people hear probably watched DBZ first, or at least were introduced to DBZ first (myself included). Now, of course, that might not be much of an argument since I'm sure that you could at least agree that FUNimation's dub of DBZ is clearly distinguishable from either their interpretation of DB or the original Japanese version of DB, but the thing is, I have watched quite a lot of the original DB and DBZ (though, with subtitles, of course), and I still feel that there are many differences between the 2 series. I even felt that way when reading the manga, in how different the beginning was from the later parts of the story.

I did also argue if even a new fan (or even an older fan) watched the two series' in proper order the line between the two would be heavily blurred. Now, neither of the three (four?) North American generations have been allowed to properly view Dragon Ball from the beginning. We've all been forced to 'begin' pretty much in the middle: Raditz. Ignoring that influence, I see less and less reason to seperate the two as if they were two different entities...unless of course the topic's creator meant it specifically in terms of both series' as anime.

But I also wouldn't say that it was the 22nd Budokai was, either. It was when Piccolo stepped into the story that things took a more serious turn, but evne then there were still plenty of parts that had that classic DB sense of humor, such as Pilaf serving under Piccolo and serving as a minor comic relief of sorts for a brief time, and there was also Yajirobe, who was also another clear comic relief character that you would expect to come out of early DB.

In terms of Tenshinhan being threatening, I don't see it the same way as you do, since he was on the same general level of skill and power as Goku was. When I said serious threat, I meant enemies who far outpowered Goku, to the point in which even after becoming stronger, he still needed help from others to defeat the opponent. At the beginning of DBZ, Master Roshi implies that Goku has gotten stronger over the past 5 years, and how it surprised hime because he expected him to be much weaker, if anything, being that he probably didn't expect Goku to really keep up with his training. Yet, even then he needed the help of Piccolo to defeat Raditz, and even then they just barely managed to do it by sacrificing Goku's own life (the 1st time that Goku actually died at all, which made Raditz more than even a thread, if anything). And of course, as far as Vegeta goes, he was far stronger than Goku was, to the point that Goku even admitted that he was outclassed by him, even after all of Kaio's training (wecept for when he used Kaio-Ken x3 or higher, which gave him an edge, but he couldn't even keep it up for nearly long enough). In theend it took the combined efforts of him, Gohan, Krillin, and even Yajirobe to defeat Vegeta, and even then they got really lucky with Gohan's involunatry transformation catching Vegeta off-guard at the last second.

Also, in early DB (at least from what I read in the manga), Goku sends that whole Rabbit team to the moon on his power-pole. Is there even a gag in DBZ that is even close to as ridiculously over-the-top as that? I mean, I know its just one minor thing scene on a single page, but seriously, small moments like that definte huge differences to me.

Anyways, I'll just leave it off in that I think whether DB and DBZ (or as far as the manga goes, the first 16 volumes of DB compared to the rest) are very different or not is something that's purely up to how one interprets both series. I personally interpretted each very differently, and I always will see them as being very different, though they will always have that 1 core element that makes them both DB, in the end. I'd go into other details, like how I feel that Goku is more naive up until his teenage years, as opposed to his adult version, which is still child-like but also noteably more mature in certain ways, but I'm way too tired of typing now, so perhaps I'll save that for another day.

Humor didn't entirely dissappear from the 'Z half', either, but like the twenty-second Tenka'ichi it became far less prevalent. By the time of the twenty-second there was far few, if any, gags that ruled the story (the Rôshi's first fight, and Kuririn v. Chaozu being the only 'gag' built fights), but even then (and espicially in the anime) there was the personal drama of Tenshinhan. First the guy break Yamcha's leg, then Muten Rôshi begins to open his eyes to the path he is on. The story becomes far more 'serious', continuing what we saw with the introduction of Tao Pai Pai, and then leading into the Daimaô arc (which was bleak and dark). Yajirobe eating Cymbal doesn't somehow change the fact the arrival of Raditz wasn't the first true move away from the "light-hearted gag series Dragon Ball." The twenty-third Tenka'ichi also had the drama of Gokû and Kami-sama against Piccolo Daimaô who was staking his claim on the world yet again.

[Daxdiv]

Dragonball for me, I love how it was more comical, I thought the story was better, and I'm more a fan of fantasy setting than a sci-fi one which DBZ later became. I mean, Goku's an alien, Kami revealed that he was actually an alien, Time Travel, those all sound sci-fi to me.

That said, I know the saga is generally frowned upon, at least from my experience, but I really enjoyed how completely riduculous a lot of the goings on during the Buu saga were.

I liked the Buu saga because of how ridiculous it was. I mean you have Buu vs. a Small piece of candy. That had me busting out in laughter, and I think I even voted for that fight in a poll for Top 10 favorite fights.

[Yash]

I prefer Dragonball.

I think there's a more interesting story when none of the characters are as insanely balls-to-the-wall powerful as they are in Z. Especially since human characters like Tien and Yamcha are still able to play a major role. There's also more focus on Goku learning new techniques and fighting styles to help himself grow stronger, whereas in Z, there isn't much of that, and when there is, it's just power-up techniques like Kaioken or Super transformations.

Kai is amazing however. I still prefer Dragonball, but man is it an improvement.

[Desensitized]

Dragonball, though I really like Kai as well. It just seems more well rounded overall to me than Z does.